brolly Posted July 10, 2011 Share Posted July 10, 2011 This is a old problem, and I've even reported it a while ago on the HS forums:http://www.hyperspin...ead.php?t=13359I don't think BBB looked at the problem from his reply saying he hopes it will be fixed on 2.0.Basically if you leave HS on attract mode inside a system it eventually crashes, if you read that post you'll see that I came to the conclusion that this seems to happen only when you have any video with an undefined codec set on the flv meta data (video codecid=7). Not 100% sure if this is the problem or not, but it does seem to happen every time on those situations.If I test on systems where I did all the videos myself (On2 VP6 encoded) it never crashes.So, I was looking at the new Type X set and realized the codecid is set to 7 as well, so I suspected we'd have problems. I left HS on attract mode inside the Type X wheel and on 5 tries it crashed all 5. Would be good if more people could test this, because if this is the case and BBB can't fix it, this will mean the new video sets will be highly incompatible with the current version of Hyperspin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Circo Posted July 10, 2011 Share Posted July 10, 2011 This problem occurs only in the attract mode? I work with bill very closely, there is no way we want to go back to vp6 and he is redoing the video engine from scratch with 2.0.What is the meta data id on the working ones?EDIT: GOOD NEWS!!! Looks like I have the fix for this already, brolly I will try to get the new vids up late tomorrow and if you could test it for me it would be greatly appreciated. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brolly Posted July 10, 2011 Author Share Posted July 10, 2011 That would be great, sure thing just lmk when they are up and I'll test them. Fingers crossed Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Circo Posted July 10, 2011 Share Posted July 10, 2011 I have two avenues, the first and most likely solid solution will be using the f4v container over flv. Bill added support for f4v with HyperSpin 1.0 as I was toying with it at the time. Everything I'm reading seems to suggest that will work Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Circo Posted July 10, 2011 Share Posted July 10, 2011 More relevant instruction for FLV, f4v and H.264:Flash Video is the name of a file format used to deliver video over the Internet using Adobe Flash Player version 6 or newer. Flash Video content may also be embedded within SWF files. Until version 9 update 3 of the Flash Player, Flash Video referred to a proprietary file format, having the extension .FLV, but Adobe introduced new file extensions and MIME types and suggests using those instead of the old FLV: File Extension FTYP MIME Type Description .f4v ‘F4V ’ video/mp4 Video for Adobe Flash Player .f4p ‘F4P ’ video/mp4 Protected Media for Adobe Flash Player .f4a ‘F4A ’ video/mp4 Audio for Adobe Flash Player .f4b ‘F4B ’ video/mp4 Audio Book for Adobe Flash Player .flv video/x-flv Flash Video It is possible to place H.264 and AAC streams into the traditional FLV file, but Adobe strongly encourages everyone to embrace the new standard file format. There are functional limits with the FLV structure when streaming H.264 which couldn’t be overcome without a redesign of the file format. This is one of the reasons Adobe is moving away from the traditional FLV file structure. Specifically dealing with sequence headers and enders is tricky with FLV streams. Adobe is still working out if it’s possible to place On2 VP6 streams into the new file format. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nologic Posted July 10, 2011 Share Posted July 10, 2011 Well while I think moving to F4V (Renamed MP4) is a good move...and thus only need to have one set & a batch file. Since brolly is having issues with the H264 & AAC FLV's...maybe we can see if the meta data is actually the problem. brolly if you would please process the files you are having problems with...using this tool here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Circo Posted July 10, 2011 Share Posted July 10, 2011 Are you absolutely sure its as simple as a rename? What is the F4V file format? Starting with SWF files published for Flash Player 9 Update 3 (9,0,115,0), Flash Player can play F4V files. The F4V format is based on the format specified by ISO/IEC 14496-12: ISO base media file format. A large part of the F4V format involves metadata. When Flash Player loads an F4V file, various stream properties are made available to a running ActionScript program via the NetStream.onMetaData property. The available properties differ depending on the software used. The F4V file format supports an assortment of optional tag boxes that can occur within a moov box. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nologic Posted July 10, 2011 Share Posted July 10, 2011 I'm positive that F4V's are nothing more than MP4's with a different file extension name. If you really want to get in it...I'm fairly sure that a MP4 is a modified\enhanced QuickTime MOV file container.Sort of like a WebM container is a stripped down MKV container. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brolly Posted July 10, 2011 Author Share Posted July 10, 2011 I have some doubts a simple rename would fix this problem, I'm betting it has something to do with the codec used and the way Bill streams the video. But I'm open to test anything really.But if a rename is all that's needed why are there so many flv to f4v converters around? They would be a bit useless I think?I tried that injector before NoLogic, there are only 6 videocodecids that can be used on the meta data, so anything not on that list will be tagged as 7, I don't think is a problem with the meta data itself, but with the codec used.audio codec is tagged as undefined as well since it's AAC, but this crash happens with mp3 audio flvs so I think the issue is really with the video. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Circo Posted July 10, 2011 Share Posted July 10, 2011 I have some doubts a simple rename would fix this problem, I'm betting it has something to do with the codec used and the way Bill streams the video. But I'm open to test anything really. But if a rename is all that's needed why are there so many flv to f4v converters around? They would be a bit useless I think? I tried that injector before NoLogic, there are only 6 videocodecids that can be used on the meta data, so anything not on that list will be tagged as 7, I don't think is a problem with the meta data itself, but with the codec used. audio codec is tagged as undefined as well since it's AAC, but this crash happens with mp3 audio flvs so I think the issue is really with the video. I'm getting ready to go have breakfast with good old bill, i'll corner him on the issue Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nologic Posted July 10, 2011 Share Posted July 10, 2011 Okay to be clear on my part FLV's are not F4V's nor MP4...however F4V's are MP4's. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Circo Posted July 11, 2011 Share Posted July 11, 2011 I posted in more detail on the hyperspin forums but the long and the short of it is this. THe current video engine in HS has some bugs wich has been causing these issues with the attract mode since it's release. Version 2.0 has a ground up new video engine. There should be no problems with this at all in HS 2.0. This push and changes are to have a much higher quality and efficient product for HS 2.0 versus what we currently have. If I can't come up with a simple fix, then I am going to suggest holding off on updating or just don't use the in system attract mode until it's fixed with HS 2.0.Per BBB while f4v will work it will break a lot of themes as the F4V container does not use an alpha channel. So in summery, it's not really a video problem so much as a bug with HS 1.0. And this bug only affects the attract mode. In a few months HS 1.0 will be forgotton and this bug will not exist. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brolly Posted July 11, 2011 Author Share Posted July 11, 2011 Yeah, it was clear to me this wouldn't be a problem with the videos because they do run fine and it always crash on random videos and not always on the same one. This would need to be fixed on the HS side, I do hope this will be fixed on HS 2.0, I guess BBB should take some time to do some stress tests on attract mode with the new emumovies videos.For the time being I won't be upgrading to the new videos then since it will make my HS setup pretty much useless as I can't leave it running. This freeze problem doesn't happen only on attract mode though, if you leave a video looping without attract mode eventually it will crash as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Circo Posted July 11, 2011 Share Posted July 11, 2011 I'm still going to look into intermediate fixes, since I have two encoding machines now I can probably go ahead and make a temp vp6 set. I didn't realize that it happened on the wheel. I can guarantee that these new ones will work with 2.0 but if it's crashing all over in 1.0 that does defeat the purpose for new users. So I will create 2 flv sections HS 1.0 and HS 2.0, once 2.0 comes out we can kill the 1.0 vids. Brolly do you mind testing the HS 1.0 sets, I'll do one up tonight and have it ready for the morning I uploaded Type X to the flv in the HS 1.0 flv folder, if all is well, I will get all the new sets converted and this compatibility thing can be solved for the time being Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brolly Posted July 11, 2011 Author Share Posted July 11, 2011 Sure thing, I test them tonight and let you know. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Circo Posted July 11, 2011 Share Posted July 11, 2011 STOP EVERYTHING, STOP THE PRESSESHad another conversation with BBB today on this issue and what I had in store for a fix. Then he remembered we had the same problem before HyperSpin was even launched. I think I have the solution for the x.264 videos. Your right about meta data but it's not the id=7, i forgot that it needs a complete meta profile for HS. So I am going to try a fix and ill let you know where it is Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nologic Posted July 12, 2011 Share Posted July 12, 2011 Well I'm curious...as brolly already said he used FLV MetaData Injector which far as I'm aware fills in all the info needed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brolly Posted July 12, 2011 Author Share Posted July 12, 2011 Yeah I did, lets wait for Circo's fix and see what happens, maybe something extra is needed. I hope it does solve it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Circo Posted July 12, 2011 Share Posted July 12, 2011 Hmm nope I couldn't fix it. So never mind, I can make the vp6 flv's better than before but the x.264 is gonna have to wait for the new version. Brolly can you verify that the test flv's I uploaded earlier today work ok. As soon as I can verify we are good I will step it up. I think I can get the filesize a bit better, but either way it's going to be a lot better than before. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nologic Posted July 12, 2011 Share Posted July 12, 2011 Well that certainly sucks...I was really hoping you would have me eating crow...hehe brolly give me a good helping yesterday. Still spiting out feathers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brolly Posted July 12, 2011 Author Share Posted July 12, 2011 LOLI will get those VP6 videos right away and let HS run on attract mode for a while then. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brolly Posted July 13, 2011 Author Share Posted July 13, 2011 So I left Hyperspin running yesterday and totally forgot about it until tonight when I got home Good thing is that after almost 24 hours it's still running without a problem as expected, so you can go ahead and encode those videos Circo. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Circo Posted July 13, 2011 Share Posted July 13, 2011 Perfect, BBB is working on the new video code for 2.0 today and tomorrow and we will have a test app soon, you feel up to testing that when its ready? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brolly Posted July 13, 2011 Author Share Posted July 13, 2011 Great. I sure am, just let me know when it's ready. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Circo Posted July 14, 2011 Share Posted July 14, 2011 Not quite sure when the test version will be ready but I do have some good news. What we found is that the video engine in 2.0 gets along just fine with mp4's. Everything works, and it runs all day without skipping. Sooooooooo, unless something changes, when 2.0 comes out I will only have to manage one format. And we still get our 2x the quality 1/2 the size benefit. Bad news is 1.0 has the same problems it always did . So after all this work I am still in the same place I was before with 1.0. I had thought he told me HS 1.0 was f4v compatable but I was wrong. 2.0 is gonna be something special Front-Ends now compatable with mp4 -HyperSpin 2.0 -GameEx -Mala (Almost) Not Compatable: -Maximus (Dead Project) -HyperSpin 1.0 (FLV Only) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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